Disenchanted w/ mundane world: Beth Upton

• Beth Upton update: Wildflowers and Wanderings

Disenchantment with the Mundane World: Conversation with former Theravada Buddhist nun

Disenchantment: Untold Tales

(The Theory of Samsara) Jan. 8, 2026: In this in-depth conversation on Ultimate Meaning: The Theory of Samsara, I speak with British Buddhist meditation teacher Beth Upton, a former fully ordained Theravāda Buddhist nun (Sayalay Anuttara) in Burma who spent nearly ten years training under Pa Auk Sayadaw (Ven. Bhaddanta Āciṇṇa) in the Burmese forest meditation tradition.

 

She shares her journey from ordination at age 25, through years of rigorous monastic training in calm-and-insight (samatha-vipassanā), to her decision to disrobe and teach as a lay practitioner in the West.

Together, we explore some of the most misunderstood questions in contemporary Buddhism, including:

• 

  Let go until success then go teach the world.

  What truly leads someone to renounce samsaric life
• Disenchantment vs. curiosity on the path to liberation
• Whether Buddhist enlightenment is possible for lay Buddhist practitioners
• The lived meaning of renunciation beyond philosophy
• Tranquility versus insight (samatha vs. vipassanā) — and why “vipassanā” is often a misused term
• Ultimate reality, momentariness (moment-to-moment presence), and non-self
• Why deep meditation can feel fragile outside the context of monastic life
• The role of community, wise friends, and authentic teachers
• Commercialization of Dharma vs. teaching by donation
• Sectarianism between Theravāda, Mahāyāna, and Tibetan Vajrayana Buddhism
• Why liberation is not just for “other cultures” or monastics

Canadian interviewer Lama Choga

This dialogue is not about spiritual abstract beliefs or spiritual ideals, but about what actually works when confronting disappointment (dukkha, suffering), impermanence, and the [impersonal] realities of samsara in modern life.

Chapters/Timestamps

• 00:00 – Intro: Beth Upton and Path [to End] Samsara
• 02:18 – Why she chose ordination as a British Buddhist nun at age 25
• 05:10 – Meeting authentic Buddhist teachers and the power of sangha [community]
• 08:32 – Experimenting with life and early renunciation
• 12:45 – Discovering liberation as a real possibility
• 16:40 – Is enlightenment possible for lay practitioners?
• 19:55 – Stream entry, arahantship, and Theravāda views
• 24:10 – Did Beth Upton meet enlightened beings?
• 27:05 – Why she disrobed after 10 years as a forest nun
• 33:40 – Fragility of meditation outside monastic life
• 37:55 – Teaching the Dharma authentically in the West
• 41:50 – Disenchantment with samsara: knowing it in the bones
• 47:30 – Cycles of renunciation and returning to the world
• 52:15 – Creating long-term retreat communities in Europe
• 56:40 – Teaching by donation rather than selling the Dharma
• 1:01:30 – Can deep meditation be practiced while working?
• 1:06:55 – Permanent retreatants and Western monastic models
• 1:10:40 – Environmental ethics in Buddhist practice
• 1:15:25 – Sectarianism: Southeast Asian Theravāda vs. Tibetan [Vajrayana] Buddhism
• 1:21:10 – Personal liberation vs. compassion for all beings
• 1:26:30 – Shamatha vs. vipassanā: clearing the confusion
• 1:33:10 – Ultimate reality and momentariness explained
• 1:39:45 – Causality, impermanence, and non-self
• 1:45:20 – Reflexive awareness and observing mind moments
• 1:52:10 – How to find wise friends and authentic teachers
• 1:57:30 – Final advice for Western practitioners
• 2:00:10 – Closing reflections and future conversations

Lama Choga and a Canadian Buddhist Sangha

If serious about meditation, renunciation, and understanding liberation beyond romantic [New Age] spirituality, this conversation offers rare clarity and lived insight.

🙏 Keep wise friends. Beth Upton's YouTube channel: @beth.upton.meditation

• Beth Upton's website: bethupton.com
• Previous videos about Beth Upton's backstory: About Me
• Episode 138: Trained as a Nun - Beth Upton
• Canadian Lama Choga: ultimatemeaning.org
• Meditációs elvonulások (Gánti Bence)
• Disenchantment: Untold Tales, Vol. 1 (book by Matt Groening)

How this was made: Auto-dubbed. Audio tracks for some languages were automatically generated. #DharmaTalk #Samsara #Buddhism #Theravada #Vipassana #MeditationPractice #Renunciation #Liberation #Enlightenment #BuddhistNun #PaAuk #NonSelf #FourNobleTruths #EightfoldPath #SpiritualPractice #Mindfulness #Jhanna #EasternPhilosophy #ultimatemeaning

• Host Lama Choga (The Theory of Samsara, Jan. 2026), guest Beth Upton; Dhr. Seven, Amber Larson (eds.), Wisdom Quarterly

Dalai Lama, how do we find our dharma?

How to choose your dharma [religion, doctrine, or social duty] and end your confusion forever

• dharma is a multivalent term with at least a dozen distinct meanings. In India, dharma usually means "social duty or obligation," and Dharma (capitalized) customarily refers to the Buddha's Dharma or Doctrine, the Teachings of the historical figure Siddhartha Gautama. The word can loosely be construed to mean "religion," but religion did not mean religion in pre-British invasion India (Maha Bharat), so equating the terms is incorrect.

Blogisattva Award finalist and winner

What are awards for?

We have a 20-year archive, from the time we were a print edition to expanding worldwide by going digital, Wisdom Quarterly: American Buddhist Journal has been at it to make the Dharma known in the West. The Blogisattva Awards (blogisattva.org) were often the golden ring to strive for. Wow, what if we could wrangle one of them by talking about Dharma and rock and rap music, or sex and morality, or the most subtle philosophical concepts and a good workout for a fit body for a bodhisattva to endeavor? That'd be something.

(SmartHistory) Bodhisattva at the Metropolitan Museum of Art, New York

Bodhisattvas ("persons bent on enlightenment") are by definition not enlightened.

The Buddha was the original Bodhisattva; it is how he referred to himself prior to it.

Nate at Precious Metal

If readers enjoy Buddhist blogs of any variety, there are two gentlemen who did a lot of work to bring this gift to the online Dharma community, Kyle of The Reformed Buddhist (X/@ReformedBuddha) and Nate Demontigny of Precious Metal (X/@PreciousMetal). Blogisattva Award winners, when they're announced, if they're announced, are announced in December. We'll keep our fingers crossed.

Kyle at The Reformed Buddhist

Wisdom Quarterly is the leading independent journal of Buddhism in the West, where it continues to be the most incisive and outrageous, possibly even the most widely read platform for the spreading of Buddhist points of view and liberal values. We cover all schools and sects, while trying to cleave to the original texts of the historical Buddha for final answers, yet recognizing that all teachers, traditions, and lineages must have something good or they would not persist.

There's a broader culture and a more Buddhistic point of view on how to face the challenges of the world with hope and the ambition of bringing compassion and enlightenment or at least rancor (fomenting controversy) and exploring the counterintuitive to get at Truth. If you don't like us, you might like these gentler outlets:

• Buddhistdoor Global
• Blogisattva Award Finalists named! - Tricycle: The Buddhist Review
• Buddhists | Pew Research Center
• The Imaginariums of the Nuns: Days That Are Past and Futures That May Yet Be | Ven. Sujato’s Blog
• Ven. Subhuti the American Monk | American Monk: Life with Buddha, Dhamma, and Saṅgha
• Top 20+ famous Buddhist scientists (like Canadian Dvorsky) that you should know 2024
• Buddhism from the National Geographic
• West Wight Sangha: Blogisattva
• Scott Mitchell (Buddhist scholar)
• Nathan for Fierce Dandelions: Blogisattva Awards and Dark, Cold Meditation

That time the Buddha said he kills people

Dhr. Seven, Pat Macpherson (eds.), Wisdom Quarterly; Ven. Thanissaro (original translation), Kesi Sutta: "To Kesi the Horse Trainer" (AN 4.111 PTS: A ii 111) from accesstoinsight.org

Agustin Geraldo illustration (caveira, desenhos, transcendência. pinterest.com.mx)

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The Buddha sits on a skull (ปลอดค่าลิขสิทธิ์)

[Thus have I heard.] One day Kesi the Horse Trainer went to the Blessed One (the Buddha), bowed, and sat respectfully to one side. Sitting there, the Blessed One said to him:

"Kesi, trained man that you are, trainer of horses to be tamed, tell me, how do you train a horse to be tamed?"

"Venerable sir, I train a horse to be tamed with gentleness, or [sometimes] with harshness, or with a skillful mix of both gentleness and harshness."

"But, Kesi, what if a horsed to be tamed submits neither to mild training nor to harsh training nor to a skillful mix of both mild and harsh training, what do you do?"

I will kill you, you untamable demon-horse!

"Venerable sir, if a horse to be tamed neither submits to mild training nor to harsh training nor to a skillful mix of both mild and harsh training then I kill it. And, sir, why is that? [I kill it thinking,] 'Do not let this be a disgrace to my lineage of teachers.' But, venerable sir, the Blessed One is the unexcelled trainer of [gods and men, that is, devas and human beings] those to be tamed. How do you train a person to be tamed?"

Prince Sid had a famous white pony, Kanthaka

"Kesi, I train a person to be tamed with gentleness, or [sometimes] with harshness, or with a skillful mix of both gentleness and harshness.

"In training with gentleness [I teach],

• 'Such is skillful bodily conduct [karma]. Such is the result of skillful bodily conduct.
• Such is skillful verbal conduct. Such is the result of skillful verbal conduct.
• Such is skillful mental conduct. Such is the result of skillful mental conduct.
• Such are the shining ones (devas). Such are human beings.'

"In training with harshness [I teach],

• 'Such is unskillful bodily conduct. Such is the result of unskillful bodily conduct.
• Such is unskillful verbal conduct. Such is the result of unskillful verbal conduct.
• Such is unskillful mental conduct. Such is the result of unskillful mental conduct.
• Such is [rebirth in] hell(s).
• Such is [rebirth in] the realm of animals.
• Such is [rebirth in] the realm of hungry ghosts.'

"In using a skillful mix of both gentleness and harshness [I teach],

• 'Such is skillful bodily conduct. Such is the result of skillful bodily conduct.
• Such is unskillful bodily conduct. Such is the result of unskillful bodily conduct.
• Such is skillful verbal conduct. Such is the result of skillful verbal conduct.
• Such is unskillful verbal conduct. Such is the result of unskillful verbal conduct.
• Such is skillful mental conduct. Such is the result of skillful mental conduct.
• Such is unskillful mental conduct. Such is the result of unskillful mental conduct.
• Such is [rebirth among] devas.
• Such is [rebirth among] humans.
• Such is [rebirth among] hellions.
• Such is [rebirth among] animals.
• Such is [rebirth among] hungry ghosts.'"

"But, venerable sir, what if a person to be tamed submits neither to mild training nor to harsh training nor to a skillful mix of mild and harsh training, what do you do?"

"Kesi, if a person to be tamed submits neither to mild training nor to harsh training nor to a skillful mix of both mild and harsh training then I kill the person."

"But, venerable sir, it is improper for the Blessed One to take life! Yet the Blessed One just said, 'I kill the person'!"

Venerable sir, teach and guide us to awaken. - This is skillful, this is not. Go practice Dhamma.

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"Kesi, it is true that it is improper for a Tathagata [Wayfarer, the Buddha referring to himself] to take life. But if a person to be tamed submits neither to mild training nor to harsh training nor to a skillful mix of both mild and harsh training then the Tathagata regards that person as being neither worth speaking to nor admonishing.

• [NOTE: The Buddha never killed nor called for anyone to be literally killed. He did, however, lay down a "higher punishment" (brahma = "supreme" + danda = "rod," a figurative brahmastra). What is it? It is being shunned and ignored by the Sangha (the community of monks and nuns). This is not excommunication because it is not final, only a last resort to try to bring someone to his or her senses and correct a pernicious "wrong view" that person may be holding and acting on. See the case of Channa, the Buddha's charioteer who took care of his horse, Kanthaka. He later became a monk but was very proud of his affiliation with the Buddha as Prince Siddhartha. Indeed, this penalty had the intended effect: Ven. Channa came to his senses and, far from being "killed" was cured of his pride. See Channa Sutta.]

Buddha in the Ocean of Blood (Tatiana Basova)

"In addition, that person's noble friends (kalyana-mittas) in the pure life regard that person as being neither worth speaking to nor admonishing.

"Kesi, this is what it means to be 'utterly destroyed in this Doctrine and Discipline' [the Buddha's Teaching and Training] -- when the Tathagata regards one as being neither worth speaking to nor admonishing, and one's noble friends in the pure life regard one as being neither worth speaking to nor admonishing."

"Indeed, venerable sir, one is utterly destroyed [killed] if the Tathagata regards that person as being neither worth speaking to nor admonishing — and even one's noble friends in the pure life regard that person as being neither worth speaking to nor admonishing!

"Magnificent, venerable sir, magnificent! It is just as if one were to set upright what had been overturned, as if to reveal what had been hidden, as if to show the way to one who were lost, as if to carry a lamp into the dark so that those with eyes could see forms!

Kesi (Hinduism) is a demon in shape of a horse

"In the same way has the Blessed One — through many lines of reasoning — made the Dhamma clear. I go to the Blessed One for guidance, to the Dhamma, and to the [noble] Sangha [community of enlightened persons]. May the Blessed One remember me as a lay follower who has gone to him for guidance from this day forward for life."

• Kesi Sutta: "To Kesi the Horse Trainer" (accesstoinsight.org)
• Buddhism rejects death penalty/capital punishment

Gradual Instructions to Enlightenment, Pt. 1

"Gradual Training" (accesstoinsight.org); Amber Larson, Dhr. Seven (eds.), Wisdom Quarterly

Gandhara Buddha (ArunHaridharshan/flickr.com)

The Buddha's Teaching, the Dharma, was taught in an incremental way. This method of "gradual instruction," or ānupubbī-kathā, appears in countless sutras.

It always follows the same arc: As a skillful teacher, a "master physician," the Buddha guides hearers (savakas) from first principles to progressively more advanced teachings, all the way to the fulfillment of the Four Noble Truths, which is the full realization of nirvana.

Perceiving those capable of understanding the liberating message, regardless of their appearance or caste or social standing, he taught them in this way. There is the example of the leper:

Having encompassed the knowing of the entire assembly with his knowing, the Blessed One asked himself, "Who here is capable of understanding the Dharma?"

He then noticed Suppabuddha the leper sitting in the assembly, and the thought occurred to him, "This person is capable of understanding the Dharma."

Turning his attention to Suppabuddha the leper, he gave a step-by-step discourse, that is, a talk on 

• generosity,
• a talk on virtue,
• a talk on heavens.
• He declared the drawbacks, degradation, and danger of sensual attachments and the rewards of renunciation, of letting go, of freedom.

Then when he perceived that Suppabuddha the leper's mind/heart was ready, malleable, free from the hindrances, joyful, bright, and temporarily purified (released), he gave a talk on the Dharma unique to enlightened ones (who have realized it for themselves):

1. suffering
2. origination
3. cessation
4. the path leading to its cessation (to complete liberation).

And just as a cloth freed of stains would properly absorb a dye, as Suppabuddha the leper was sitting in that very seat, the "stainless eye of the Dharma" arose in him: "Whatever is subject to arising is also subject to cessation" (Verses of Uplift, Udana 5.3).

This "gradual instruction" pattern of a sutra (a suture, a thread that ties them together) progressing through stages was utilized by the Buddha to prepare listeners' hearts/minds before speaking on the more advanced teaching of the Four Noble Truths.

The stock passage (e.g., DN 3, DN 14, MN 56), according to Ven, Nyanatiloka (Buddhist Dictionary), runs as follows:

"Then the Blessed One gave a gradual instruction -- that is to say, speaking on giving (letting go), virtuous conduct (sila), and the heavens (sagga), then explaining the peril, the folly, and the depravity of [craving and addiction to] sensual pleasures and, moreover, the advantages of renouncing.

"When the Blessed One perceived that the listener's mind was prepared, pliant, freed of obstacles [hindrances], elevated and lucid, he explained that exalted teaching particular to the buddhas (buddhānam sāmukkamsikā desanā), that is: suffering, its cause, its undoing, and the path [to its undoing]" (BD).

"Food for the Heart (Collected Teachings)"

Abhayagiri Monastic Foundation, Audible; Dhr. Seven, Ellie Askew (eds.), Wisdom Quarterly

Foreword by Jack Kornfield. Introduction by Ajahn Amaro. Only from Audible.

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Food for the Heart: The Collected Teachings of Ajahn Chah

Why do we practice? We practice to let go.

Renowned for the simplicity and beauty of his teaching of Buddhism, Ajahn Chah was Thailand's best-known Theravada meditation teacher.

His charisma and wisdom influenced many American and European seekers of enlightenment, and they helped shape the American vipassana (insight meditation) community.

This collection brings together for the first time Ajahn Chah's most powerful teachings, including those on meditation, liberation from suffering, calming the mind, enlightenment, and the "living Dharma."

Most of these talks have previously been available only in limited, private editions. Therefore, the publication of Food for the Heart represents a momentous occasion: the hugely increased accessibility of this Buddhist master's words and wisdom.

Western Buddhist teachers such as Jack Kornfield, Ram Dass, Trudy Goodman, Goenka, and British monks Ajahn Brahm, Ajahn Amaro, and Ajahn Sumedho have extolled Ven. Chah's teachings for years, and now listeners can experience them directly in this release. More + AUDIO SAMPLE

"Unravelling the Mysteries of Mind & Body"

Sayalay Susila, Abhidharma text, edited by Dhr. Seven, Wisdom Quarterly UPDATED

Pa Auk Sayadaw, Sayalay, and Dhr. Seven (ed.) set out the Buddha's "Higher Teachings"

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Ultimately (Aidan McRae Thomson)

Unravelling the Mysteries of Mind & Body Through Abhidhamma, the long awaited book by the accomplished Buddhist monastic Sayalay Susila and Wisdom Quarterly editor Dhr. Seven, is available at amazon.com and from Inward Wisdom Books.

It is based on the work of Pa Auk Sayadaw as he directly penetrated the Buddha's teachings on the subject of the Ultimate Doctrine or Abhdharma.

All proceeds from the book support the establishment of Appamada Vihari, Sayalay Susila's meditation center, offering an opportunity for all to accumulate merit to advance on the Buddhist path toward enlightenment in this very life.
 

Why would anyone go on a meditation retreat?

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ABOUT

Ven. Sayalay Susila, Grand Canyon

Unravelling the Mysteries of Mind & Body Through Abhidhamma is based on a series of PowerPoint presentations and talks on the Abhidharma by Sayalay Susila as she learned it directly from her enlightened teacher.

It is based directly on instructions by famed Burmese Buddhist Meditation Master Pa Auk Sayadaw -- presented by the Chinese-Malaysian Buddhist nun Sayalay Susila on her trips around the U.S. and Canada in 2002.

How much longer will the liberating Dharma survive in the world? (Mikecogh/flickr.com)

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Repeatedly told how helpful these talks were in illuminating this complex subject, Sayalay developed them into a startlingly clear visual presentation then this book, now in a completely re-edited edition.

At first glance the Abhidharma can appear so dry and complicated as to be impenetrable. Just ask Bhikkhu Bodhi, who attempts to teach it at BAUS.org.

It may, therefore, seem dull and irrelevant, a mere commentary to the sutras rather than a systematic treatment of what is needed to attain enlightenment -- the details, the explanations, the factors explained in extreme detail.

 

The Buddha among devas explaining the Abhidharma leading to final liberation

 

That it has been largely overlooked outside of Burma comes as no surprise. But the Sayadaw, Sayalay, and Seven have made Abhidharma accessible by employing direct and concrete language, clear analogies, and simple anecdotes primarily based on the experiences of real meditators in Asia, America, and Europe over many years.

The essence of Abhidharma is drawn out from its vast and complex matrix. Doing so makes it utterly practical, relating to everyday life in a way practitioners find meaningful for ordinary living. The way to realization is through concentration-and-insight meditation instruction to tie together theory and practice.

First edition (holybooks.com)

In this way analytical knowledge is made available for direct personal realization in meditation (bhavana, cultivation and development of various kinds). By providing clarity, this book helps practitioners come to a knowing-and-seeing, or knowledge and vision, of Abhidharma as a path revealed by the historical Buddha. It that its application, not its theoretical grasping, leads to happiness, mundane and supramundane.

May all beings -- humans, devas, and others -- share in the blessings of this offering of liberating-wisdom.

Who sees the Dharma (Dependent Origination) sees the Buddha (MN 28; Mikecogh)

"The Buddha’s Practical Teaching"

John D. Ireland, The Buddha's Practical Teaching (BPS.lk); Dhr. Seven (ed.), Wisdom Quarterly

I love the Dharma, the Path to Freedom!

Comments on the Buddha Word (Bodhi Leaves #16, BPS.lk) attempts to demonstrate the theoretical aspect of the Four Noble Truths of Buddhism and their continuous presentation, in various guises, throughout the Sutra Collection (Sutta Piṭaka) of the Pali canon.

The Four Noble Truths are the central, essential, and characteristic feature of Buddhism. Its goal is the complete understanding and penetration of them. They are "Buddhism in a Nutshell."

1. All conditioned-things are disappointing.
2. There is a cause of disappointment.
3. There is an end to disappointment.
4. There is a path leading to the end of it.

Time is an illusion, but I should have started sooner.

The Buddha has stated that it is because of not understanding and not fully comprehending the Four Ennobling (enlightening) Truths that living beings suffer.

Beings are constantly becoming, never static, wandering on ad nauseum through the cyclical rebirth process (powered by karma, manifesting on various planes of existence).

We are trapped between incessant rebirth and consequent (re-)death, subject to unfathomable suffering via innumerable disappointments.

1. Not all conditioned-phenomena are pleasant.
2. There is a reason why.
3. There is an all-pleasant state (nirvana, the unconditioned).
4. There is a path to it.

Let's be quite clear what is meant by "understanding." Firstly, there is the understanding arising from reading and hearing (suta-maya-ñāṇa) about the Dharma, the Buddha's Teachings.

This is, of course, only the first step, insufficient by itself but nevertheless to be done carefully because a wrong grasp of the letter and meaning, at this stage, will adversely affect the following stages of understanding.

Then there is the understanding arising from contemplating and thinking over (cinta-maya-ñāṇa) what one has learned, drawing out the implications of the words, digesting, and relating them to personal experience.

All my effort last time paid off in this life!

Finally, there is the understanding arising from actually putting the Buddha's Teaching into practice -- “understanding derived from cultivation” (bhavana-maya-ñāṇa),  that is,  by  meditation and other practical applications -- treading the path that culminates in the direct experience of nirvana, the ultimate aim of Buddhism.

And this last type of understanding is what is intended here. Then the Four Stages of Enlightenment arise in due order, consisting of an understanding that is irreversible -- never to be lost -- and which may be called to mind whenever one wishes.

 

The final stage of enlightenment is complete deliverance of mind from all suffering. To have actual assurance of this final goal, it is imperative to reach the initial stage, called the "Path of Stream-entry" or the "possession of clear seeing" into the Four Noble Truths.

Without reaching this stage we have no actual guarantee of making irreversible progress on the Buddha’s path to freedom from all suffering. We are liable to be swept away and lose all that has been gained in a single moment if circumstances go against us, as would happen, for instance, if we were to die before reaching this stage.

The Buddha teaches that it may be very long indeed before we might become fortunate enough to hear of the Dharma again and have the capacity to be able to put it into practice.

Therefore, our aim should be to reach this stage of certainty and self-assurance, this Path of Stream-entry.

The question now arises how are we to produce that kind of understanding leading to enlightenment? The answer lies in the preparedness of the mind for understanding.

Many times in the Buddhist sutras we are told of individuals who, on hearing but a few words on the Teaching immediately gained a deep understanding and attained the stages of enlightenment, apparently without effort.

But these are actually exceptional cases. Most of the Buddha’s disciples had to go through a long and laborious training before being ready to attain the goal. More

In the seen, let there be only the seen (sutra)

Maurice O'Connell Walshe (trans.), Malunkyaputta Sutra (SN 35.95) edited and updated by Dhr. Seven, Ellie Askew, Ananda (D.M.I.), Wisdom Quarterly

Grasshopper, what would you have me say?

[The Buddhist monk Ven. Malunkyaputta ("Mel") once requested of the Buddha:]

 

"Venerable sir, it would be good for me if the Blessed One would teach me in brief a doctrine so that, having heard it, I might dwell withdrawn, secluded (from all distractions and sense desires), full of energy, ardent, and resolute."

 

"Well now, Mel, what am I to say to the younger monastics if you -- a frail, aged, and venerable man far gone in years, at the end of your life -- ask for instruction in brief?"

 

"What do you think, Mel? Objects cognizable by the eye, not seen, that you have not seen before, that you do not see now, and do not wish to see -- have you any desire, lust, or fondness for them?"

 

"No, indeed, venerable sir."

• [The same is then said regarding sounds, scents, flavors, tangibles, and mental objects.]

"Well then, Mel, in things seen, heard, otherwise sensed (muta, smelled, tasted, or touched), or cognized:

 

"In the seen, let there be only the seen, in the heard only the heard, in the otherwise sensed only the otherwise sensed, in the cognized only the cognized...

 

"Then, Mel, there will be no 'thereby'* for you.

• *This is almost impossible to translate adequately because, literally, there is no agent here,  no "seer," "feeler," or "knower." "There will be no 'thereby' whereby one will be lustful, hateful, or deluded (SA [SN commentary])."

"Having no 'thereby' you have no 'there.'*

• *If there is no agent (i.e., no "self") then there is nowhere such an agent can be located. "You will have no 'there'": you will not be bound "here" nor attached "there," i.e., with regard to the seen, heard,  otherwise sensed, or cognized (SA).

"Having no 'there,' Mel, there will be for you neither this world, nor the next, nor anywhere in between.* That in itself is the end of suffering."

• *"You will realize that [in an ultimate sense] nothing [no "self" or "ego" of any kind] is really reborn."

"Indeed, venerable sir, I understand in full the meaning of what the Blessed One has stated in brief."

 

Forms perceived cause loss of mindfulness,

If we dwell on their endearing charms,

Passion grips the heart, and feeling flows,

Clinging has us firmly in its grip:

So emotions rise and grow in strength,

Of diverse kinds, all based on what was seen.

Some of greed and some of hate born —

Grievously they all afflict the human heart,

Heaping up his store of pain and disappointment:

Thus for such a person nirvana's far away.

• [The same is said for sounds, scents, tastes, tangibles, and thoughts (objects of mind).]

One who's not inflamed by things one sees,

Seeing forms retains one's mindfulness,

Not in passion's grip, simply feels,

On such a one, clinging cannot get any hold.

If one just observes the things one sees,

Not reacting to their shape or form,

One will pull down the pile, not build it up.

Mindfully proceeding on one's way,

Heaping up no store of pain or disappointment:

Then for one nirvana's very near.

• [The same is said for sounds, scents, tastes, tangibles, and thoughts (mind objects).]

"Indeed, venerable sir, I understand in full the meaning of what the Blessed One has stated in brief."

• [This would mean that Mel has become enlightened to at least the first stage (stream entry) by understanding and  penetrating the impersonal nature of all existence, the Five Aggregates clung to as self. Indeed, the Buddha confirms Mel's words. In due course, Mel/Ven. Malunkyaputta becomes fully enlightened, an arahant.]

Studying the Sutras with Bhikkhu Bodhi (NY)

Bhikkhu Bodhi (BAUS.org/en/activities); Dhr. Seven, Amber Larson (eds.), Wisdom Quarterly

The Numerical Discourses of the Buddha

American monk Ven. Bodhi

“The Numerical Discourses” (Anguttara Nikaya) arranges the sutras of the Buddha according to a numerical pattern, grouping together sutras that revolve around the same number of items, from “The Book of the Ones” to “The Book of the Elevens.”

This class starts at 9:00 am with a 50-minute silent meditation. This is followed by a discussion of the sutras from 10:00 am to 11:20 am. This section of the class will continue with the study of “The Book of the Threes.”

What are the words of the Buddha?

Bhikkhu Bodhi has translated the entire Anguttara Nikaya, published by Wisdom Publications (Boston, 2012, 1900 pages) under the title The Numerical Discourses of the Buddha. A FREE electronic file of the sutras in “The Book of the Threes” to be studied can be found here. More

• Chaung Yen Monastery
• Buddhist Association of the United States (baus.org)
• Carmel, Upstate New York